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Author Topic: Warrington Vehicle Fire: FF Down  (Read 9853 times)
oldmanfire
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Posts: 220


« Reply #30 on: March 27, 2011, 08:25:15 PM »

I started as a New York fireman in 1973 and am still active today, you have a big mouth about calls you have no infomation on. I know who you are and think you should think before you talk.

You know what, it isn't worth it.

I am happy the firefighters are getting better.  That is all.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2011, 07:29:46 AM by oldmanfire » Logged
TOHSO
Newbie
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Posts: 34


« Reply #31 on: March 28, 2011, 09:07:13 AM »

First let me express my sincerest hopes that both fully recover and are back in service as soon as possible.

Just a thought: any time comments, either positive or negative, are made regarding an incident or injury, there always seems to be the assumption that blame is being assessed. Personally, I read the story, comments, and links with interest because quite frankly, I had NO idea that off-road tires were filled with any kind of substance other than air. From that standpoint, I'm grateful for the great exchange of info.

As a Training Officer with a strong interest in incident safety, I'm not looking to assign blame, but instead to first understand what happened, then ask the internal question: could it have been avoided? Unlike the stereotype being passed around, I'm fully aware there will always be hazards we cannot detect or avoid at a fire scene; it's just too dynamic. Based on what I read (the firefighters being 25 feet away and at a 45 degree angle), I can't honestly find any fault....those are tried and true tactics that have always worked in the past. What I can learn and do though, is at least make my people aware that these vehicles could pose a significant threat.





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boston_rake
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Posts: 178


« Reply #32 on: March 28, 2011, 09:39:45 AM »

TOHSO - good comments. My argument for Monday Morning QBing on this forum has always been that - to exchange information to help everyone learn from any job. It happened to the Warrington guys - now everyone in the county should learn from this and nobody else should ever be hurt in a situation like this.

I'm curious to hear what the tires were filled with and if that had anything to do with the intensity of the explosion.

I also agree that I don't find fault in anything they did, based on the knowledge that I have (which I admit isn't much). But if there are lessons to be learned here I suggest the guys at the scene should share that.

Maddog... from what I can tell, you're attacking someone based on their view that you shouldn't jump off the apparatus masked up. Do you disagree with that statement? Is that they way you did it in New York in 1973? I seriously doubt it.

I also never put my mask on before exiting the apparatus for all the reasons stated. I always do a size-up before I put myself or the guys under my command in danger.

I once saw a FF mask up before exiting the engine. He ran from the engine and went into the WRONG HOUSE because he couldn't see what the hell he was doing.
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Firemantom
Jr. Member
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Posts: 63


« Reply #33 on: March 28, 2011, 09:47:22 AM »

Hey How about this, It is the Fire Service, we are going to get hurt, shit happens, and people die doing this job if anyone thinks that can not happen to them wake up. So no matter how much we train, or preplan, something bad is going to happen somewhere at sometime to someone, lets those who got hurt rest up and those who (station managment) have to deal with workman comp, and probably OSHA or whoever investigates accident where firefighters get hurt do their job and the rest of you worry about  something else. Its another life lesson about our job....it dangerous, and you could get hurt or die, maybe that should be the first sentence you learn the first day you start learning to be a fireman.
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madirishman
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Posts: 113


« Reply #34 on: March 28, 2011, 12:22:08 PM »

One thing to consider here is that it may not have been the tire that caused the explosion.

From Chief 29:

"The explosion was so powerful that it blew one of the rear tires and axles off of the tractor, shooting shrapnel all over the place."

"It took the drive shaft and everything and projectiles towards them," explained Chief Bean. "They were actually caught up in the fireball itself."

The fire had a bit of a head start and wasn't called in right away.  Something else on the loader could have caused the explosion.  It will be interesting to hear what the final investigation provides.

Update:  both FF's had to return to Temple burn unit due to some minor complications.
Both were treated and released again.  Speedy recovery to both.
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MBean
Newbie
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Posts: 1


« Reply #35 on: March 28, 2011, 02:31:51 PM »

I would like to thank everyone who has posted, called and e-mailed expressing their concern for the members of the Warrington Township Fire Co. I would also like to express my thanks to the fire service community by stepping in and covering us while we needed to attend to our injuried members. I have posted a brief description of the incident on our web site, so please visit our site to get a ture understanding of what happened. If anyone has any questions about the incident please feel free to contact me at mjbeaner@comcast.net

Thank you M.Bean Chief 29

 WWW.Warringtonfire.com

 
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onlyavolly
Jr. Member
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Posts: 93


« Reply #36 on: March 28, 2011, 02:50:11 PM »

Trap58.

Split Rim's are illegal and you will not see them on over the road trucks.  You will see tube type tires that may have or or two lock rings.  Most people call any type of wheel that is not a single piece a split rim and this is not true.
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TOHSO
Newbie
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Posts: 34


« Reply #37 on: March 29, 2011, 08:44:36 AM »

Boston...after reading the story and comments, I did a little research and spoke to a member of my department who works with heavy equipment. He confirmed that in SOME instances, operators will fill the tires with a calcium chloride and water solution as additional ballast. He also pointed out that it's usually done to equipment that's being used in an off-road situation, since driving on a hard surface can be difficult.

As someone pointed out, it may not have been the tire that exploded, so this is more of a "good thing to know" posting....

Firemantom: I have no argument with your comment except one: we still need to make sure our guys are educated enough to avoid making unnecessary/illogical/downright stupid/no benefit mistakes. Over the years I've seen a FEW firefighters do incredibly stupid things for no good reason other than an adrenaline rush.....

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XDeputy
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Posts: 248


« Reply #38 on: March 29, 2011, 09:35:51 PM »

Some other historical tidbits for particularly the newer members to file away:
There is a FF in a Montgomery County Dept. that still bears the burn scars on his hands after getting off the engine at a car fire, on the Turnpike I believe, when I believe the car exploded while he was donning his gloves.  I cannot vouch for the details nor how far he was at the time from the incident, but I have personally seen his scars.

Another Bucks Co. dept. experienced an incident at a 1995  fire in a barn that was used to store several antique cars that the FD may or may not have known about.  The 30x70 foot building was well involved and the engine positioned at a pool to draft to fight the fire.  The gas shock bumper on a 1987 Porsche 944 that was stored in the barn exploded without warning through the weakened wall of the barn, traveled across the pool and struck a ladder on the side of the engine that was about 75 feet away.  The rungs on the extension ladder were dented from the force of the impact, and at least 1 firefighter was standing in the immediate area of the impact just shortly prior to the incident occurring.  Fortunately, there were no injuries - a near-miss.
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